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Playtesting : Assault Group (1 LP)
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| zellak | Date: Tuesday, 14-Feb-2012, 12:00:42 | Message # 1 |
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As we are between campaigns and have a lot of scenarios to test before the RuF/BuF one starts.
(RuF/Buf = Red Fields / Black Fortress Nam US army style.)
Can i ask people to test this idea on the use of grenades in AT-43 ?
Please only post the findings of actual gameplay, do not post conjecture or opinion without doing any real playtesting first...Thanks.
Assault Group 1 LP
Troops who are armed with grenades (usually at +5 AP per man in the unit.) can use this Drill.
When the drill is called. the player nominates 3 men in the unit who then become an Assault Group.
The player moves these figures into contact with each other (this movement does not trigger overwatch).
These three figures now become a temporary special weapon bearer. With all rules that entails.
The temporary weapon bearer may throw grenades as per the usual rules.
Except the stats are Acc 0 RoF 1/0 Radius 6 cm Pen/ Dam 5/1 (Same stats for all armies)
Also : allow ONi Troopers to buy grenades for +5 AP per man.
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Message edited by zellak - Wednesday, 15-Feb-2012, 00:03:28
DEMON : " When next we meet, i shall tear you limb from limb...there will be no escape. "
Hero: " You bring balloon animals and i'll hire a clown..... we can make it a regular party. "
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| Balrog | Date: Tuesday, 14-Feb-2012, 21:52:28 | Message # 2 |
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Hi Z ... As I'm now a UNA player, I'd say I'm happy with the way grenades work. Being to lazy to playtest anything, my reasoning is that grenades have their own advantages/disadvantages like everything else in the AT-43 game. I would def agree their not very powerful, (Penetration/Damage: 4/1) but the category of indirect fire gives them a major bonus! For example, imagine the follow situ ...
... as u can see, the UNA can only fire with two soldiers using their rifles, but if they use their grenades EVERYONE gets a go! ... "Apple's ... what apple's? ... THEM's pineapple's yah &%$ " So, I say leave them as is and use them as their meant to be used! Another combat drill ... please no, no more ... pleaseeeee!
Walts (... that's Col. Waltazar! ... War ON!!)
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Message edited by Balrog - Tuesday, 14-Feb-2012, 23:22:31
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| gerrywithaG | Date: Tuesday, 14-Feb-2012, 23:19:34 | Message # 3 |
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THEM's pineapple's yah %&$!"
Could the administrator please edits this sentence as I find it unacceptable and please remind the poster that we have youngsters viewing this forum
CHeers
Da'Umpire
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And I am watching YOU!!!!!!!!!!!
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| Balrog | Date: Tuesday, 14-Feb-2012, 23:23:57 | Message # 4 |
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Oppppssss ... apologies one & all ... updated! Walts
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| zellak | Date: Wednesday, 15-Feb-2012, 00:06:50 | Message # 5 |
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Quote (Balrog) So, I say leave them as is and use them as their meant to be used!
No problem Walts, if you dont want to playtest them....thats up to you.
But please dont post on this thread again without doing any playtesting. Thanks. 
BTW...i dont expect this idea to be playtested enough to be in the RF/BF campaign...it might make the next one . 
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Message edited by zellak - Wednesday, 15-Feb-2012, 00:13:04
DEMON : " When next we meet, i shall tear you limb from limb...there will be no escape. "
Hero: " You bring balloon animals and i'll hire a clown..... we can make it a regular party. "
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| pavlov | Date: Thursday, 16-Feb-2012, 22:11:00 | Message # 6 |
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Hi
Im worried about posting in case I get my nuts kicked in  , it might be easier to create a sapper attachment/group like the attachment groups in the frostbite book i.e. 3 troops with grenades, modify the grenade's for larger area and have a satchel charge for afv's, or do something with shock troops so they are more attractive to player's 3 man shock groups or larger ?.
Alan
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There is f&*k all cool about 10+ civil engineers running around every battlefield
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| zellak | Date: Friday, 17-Feb-2012, 11:53:30 | Message # 7 |
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Quote (pavlov) it might be easier to create a sapper attachment/group like the attachment groups in the frostbite book
It might be easier , but will not address the main problem.
The infantryman's prime weapon as close quarters is the grenade, the AT-43 rules reflect this poorly.
Its the main weak point in the rules imho.
No one uses grenades because they are useless.
At +5 AP per man in the unit, what do you get ?
Normally a blast radius 2 or 3 CM radius that scatters 5 or 6 CM. (with an 8 man squad.)
And all the unit must throw grenades not just some, so you lose your special weapon bearer's firepower to !
Sorry if this sounds a bit of a rant...but i think AT-43 is the best skirmish system i have played, its just annoying that one of the core pieces of the rules is so
poorly written. 
I wont go on about it.
I will await some playtesting feedback.
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Message edited by zellak - Saturday, 18-Feb-2012, 21:49:17
DEMON : " When next we meet, i shall tear you limb from limb...there will be no escape. "
Hero: " You bring balloon animals and i'll hire a clown..... we can make it a regular party. "
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| Banksi | Date: Saturday, 18-Feb-2012, 21:26:03 | Message # 8 |
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Not so keen on the assault group theory.
How about an unit that has grenades can stack if more than one throws at once. The template just gets bigger the more you throw but they still stay together as one unit.
or
Assault squad - If they do separate they are like a suicide squad and you loose them after the grenades are thrown because they are out of contact with the main unit.
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Message edited by Banksi - Saturday, 18-Feb-2012, 21:31:01
Of course I know your name, it's your face I can't remember - Parahandy
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| zellak | Date: Saturday, 18-Feb-2012, 21:47:19 | Message # 9 |
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Quote (Banksi) Assault squad - If they do separate they are like a suicide squad and you loose them after the grenades are throw because they are out of contact with the main unit.
Thats a wee bit harsh, you spend an extra +40 AP on a unit , for a one shot weapon.....and then lose 3 guys.
Cant see anyone buying into that.
Quote (Banksi) How about an unit that has grenades can stack if more than one throws at once. The template just gets bigger the more you throw but they still stay together as one unit.
Then a 12 man unit would have a 12cm blast radius ( or , by the rules, a 10cm radius and everyone in the zone gets hit twice !)
Though if it misses with 8 of the dice it would still scatter 8 cm , right ?
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DEMON : " When next we meet, i shall tear you limb from limb...there will be no escape. "
Hero: " You bring balloon animals and i'll hire a clown..... we can make it a regular party. "
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| Banksi | Date: Saturday, 18-Feb-2012, 22:03:16 | Message # 10 |
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Quote (zellak) Then a 12 man unit would have a 12cm blast radius ( or , by the rules, a 10cm radius and everyone in the zone gets hit twice !)
Though if it misses with 8 of the dice it would still scatter 8 cm , right ?
I was meaning fire as one weapon! one dice
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Of course I know your name, it's your face I can't remember - Parahandy
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| zellak | Date: Saturday, 18-Feb-2012, 22:06:13 | Message # 11 |
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And if it misses scatters 10cm.
That might work. 
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DEMON : " When next we meet, i shall tear you limb from limb...there will be no escape. "
Hero: " You bring balloon animals and i'll hire a clown..... we can make it a regular party. "
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| Banksi | Date: Saturday, 18-Feb-2012, 22:11:25 | Message # 12 |
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That's worth testing and it's not far from the original rules
How about the distance and stats are based on the unit commander?
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Message edited by Banksi - Saturday, 18-Feb-2012, 22:13:44
Of course I know your name, it's your face I can't remember - Parahandy
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| zellak | Date: Sunday, 19-Feb-2012, 21:06:51 | Message # 13 |
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Aiden suggested today that the player could select the number of fighters throwing grenades. ???
Then we could roll one die to hit .
If it misses it scatters 10cm.
All the chuckers grenades stack....so 6 throwing would give a 6cm radius.
And the unit could still either fire its special weapons or split fire and overwatch with them.
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DEMON : " When next we meet, i shall tear you limb from limb...there will be no escape. "
Hero: " You bring balloon animals and i'll hire a clown..... we can make it a regular party. "
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| Banksi | Date: Thursday, 23-Feb-2012, 23:37:30 | Message # 14 |
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Quote (zellak) All the chuckers grenades stack....so 6 throwing would give a 6cm radius.
And the unit could still either fire its special weapons or split fire and overwatch with them.
I think giving a unit 3 shots is a bit much, split fire the heavy weapons Yes but overwatch only with the heavy weapons. If you throw grenades they all get thrown, it counts as shooting.
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Message edited by Banksi - Thursday, 23-Feb-2012, 23:39:04
Of course I know your name, it's your face I can't remember - Parahandy
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| zellak | Date: Friday, 24-Feb-2012, 18:00:43 | Message # 15 |
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Just to clarify this.
Lets say a unit of 12 Krasny Soldaty with 9 Assault rifles and 3 RPG, all have grenades.
Split fire only works on special weapon bearers, it enables them to fire at another time other than when the normal soldiers fire.
So....The unit could keep its RPG on overwatch if it had declared split fire at the start of the activation.
But the standard fighters would have to fire at the same time.
But if firing two different weapons, ie assault rifles and grenades, they could fire at different targets.
Example : 12 Krasny Soldaty led by a Captain encounter some nasty 3 metre tall aliens.
Captain Smirnov gives the commands to split fire and overwatch on the RPGs (he is worried about an alien Mech he has been made aware of)
His men then fire, 5 throwing grenades and 4 shooting their assault rifles.
Grenades : range 3 / accuracy 0 = 1 dice at 5+ ...5 cm radius blast Pen 5/1 (scatters 10cm if it misses.)
Assault rifles : range 3 / accuracy 2 = 4 dice with rerolls at 4+ to hit....Pen 4/1
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DEMON : " When next we meet, i shall tear you limb from limb...there will be no escape. "
Hero: " You bring balloon animals and i'll hire a clown..... we can make it a regular party. "
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